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[00:00:00] If you understand this presentation, you will understand everything. You need to know about how to stay marketable and get law firm positions throughout your entire career. And this is information that very few people understand. As a matter of fact, I would estimate that probably.

95% of people in the recruiting industry don't even understand this information. So it's very valuable information. And and if you're watching this today you're going to get information that in my opinion, could honestly change the course of your career. And the quality of the decision that you make.

And in terms of the things that you decide to do or to not do, if you wanna continue working in a law firm, and there's all sorts of reasons to work in a law firm. And I'm not gonna talk about those today, but I think law firms are really good places to have a career, and that can really lead to a lot of very positive things for the right people.

This, by the way, this stuff I'm sharing with you today

Marker

is the product of tens, if not hundreds of thousands of candidates we've worked with[00:01:00] at BCG and I'm the founder of BCG, and I've been in this business for over two decades, I've made thousands of placements. So what I'm gonna share with you today is information that's come from that.

And obviously I haven't placed everyone that I've ever worked with my first year I did, but but it's there's a lot to share here. And it's just, this is a lot of learning. It's probably, tens of thousands of hours of my learning, plus a learning of hundreds of recruiters that have worked here.

And I'm still learning every day, but I'm gonna tell you what I understand now about this business and about what makes you marketable. And and I'm gonna basically give you information that might not otherwise ever get. So I'm pretty excited to tell you about this today. And after this presentation, I will take questions.

And then whether it's about this or any questions that you may have. And I do think this information that I'm gonna share today could actually change the course of your career for the better. These are six criteria that we employ at BCG. We haven't always employed these criteria but these [00:02:00] are the criteria that we apply.

And and really these criteria, it doesn't matter where you went to law school. It doesn't matter what city you're in. If you meet these six criteria, then we pretty much always wanna work with you and law firms will hire you through us if you meet them, if you don't then sometimes we will work with people if they are otherwise exceptional, but for the most part we.

We expect these, and these are the people that get hired laterally by law firms. Now this information is really cool because if you understand all these things, you'll be able to position your career and make choices that will always if you wanna work in a law firm, if you market, because if you make choices that are not in line with this, or you go in different directions it can be very difficult for you.

So I, if you meet these six criteria, by the way you can work with us and get a position or you can get a position usually, and you, you're just very marketable in general. And it's important. So the first one, and I'm gonna talk about each of these throughout the, this webinar today in a lot [00:03:00] more depth.

So I'm just gonna list them off for you to start, and then I'll go into more detail about them. But the first one is if you have to be employed for the most part full time by a law firm as an associate or partner or council is okay, but that's pretty much a requirement you have to be doing that.

You have to have some sort of stability. In a single practice area, meaning if you've moved around between practice areas or you haven't been practicing in the practice area very long, and you're trying to get a job in another practice area, you're probably not marketable. You typically do have to be a us citizen with a JD degree in the United States.

There are certain points in time when corporate becomes very hot and sometimes people can get in that are, have the bar, but not a us J degree, but very rare very rarely. You have to be admitted to the bar or can wave into the state where you wanna work when you're moving laterally. And and that just means that it's very difficult to go to California, Florida, and other areas where you don't have a bar.

If you're moving there, you have to have it before. Even if you graduate from a top law school and you training much, almost always needed [00:04:00] you have to have between one and six years of experience working in associate in the law firm. Now sometimes you can have as many as 10 years or 12, but but generally that's the role if you have more than six years of experience and you wanna move to a firm as a partner you're typically going to need three to four times the amount of.

In business, the amount of money you expect the firm to pay. So if you wanna make a million dollars, you're typical going to need at least 3 million in businesses. An example, if you wanna make 200,000, you're gonna need at least 600,000 or you just need to be in a very specialized hard to find in demand, practice area in the market, you're seeking a position.

So that could be pat attorneys. A lot of times, with more than six years of experience are marketable, different practice areas, healthcare RSA, corporate. It just depends. If you're in a very specialized, hard to find in demand practice area, that you're seeking a market that you're seeking a job in, then you can then your marketable.

So that's really it. And if you have those six criteria [00:05:00] which believe it or not most attorneys don't then I would love to work with you. Our company would love to work with you and you are probably a very good candidate and if you meet them and understand what they are.

It's your best interest. We're engaged to hire find people that meet these criteria. We can get most people with these criteria, much better jobs if they follow our recommendations and they'll benefit tremendously. Far more than any other search method by using us. And there's no charge and we can help you.

And and you'll definitely get more interviews and jobs. When you have these qualifications than you would, if you searched on your own law firms typically when they see your applications coming through us, if you meet these criteria, take your applications very seriously. And most of the time they're more comfortable dealing with an agent than they would.

If you were applied on your own and they also feel more comfortable just as you would feel more comfortable buying a house through a realtor. Similar activity. It gives them the opportunity to ask questions. And it allows us to assist with information act as an intermediary. [00:06:00] And and this definitely can potentiate and give you much better results.

If you have these criteria and honestly, most career people that set out to work in their career in a law firm or a partner, ha have those qualifications law firms hire people that meet these six requirements because they can make a lot of money from them. And and we're hired to find people like that.

It's just, you can, if you have the right amount of experience and a specialized practice there, and you work in a law firm, you have stability and then you're definitely marketable. There's just no question about it. If you meet these criteria there's people all over the United States, that'll be interested in you.

As long as you continually meet these criteria throughout your career. You're pretty much always going to be marketable. And I don't care. As a recruiter. I place people it doesn't matter to me where you went to law school. It doesn't matter what your practice area is. None of that matters.

Most recruiters, by the way, they will say, oh, I only work with people that are at the top firms and went to the top law schools and have a certain amount of experience and partners with all this business. And that's just a [00:07:00] very kind of watered down way of saying that we're looking for specialists cuz they don't understand the kind of, the level of the, that this can go.

So the good news is regardless of what you do plaintiff's personal injury consumer bankrupt. It doesn't matter. You are marketable if you meet these six criteria and you're marketable for recruiting firm, you can get plenty of jobs and and this is what everyone is looking for. And again, it doesn't matter.

None of the stuff that you think matters, it doesn't matter. It people are always very conscious of grade points and all this kind of stuff. What matters is if you meet this criteria, I'm gonna go into a lot more. About it. And during this presentation, but this is just working with hundreds of thousands of attorneys and running statistics and data.

And this is what matters. It's the only thing that matters. And we've gotten jobs from people in every law school, every practice area it just doesn't matter. And again, using these criteria, which will you understanding them and applying to your career, regardless of whether or not you use BCG will is going to change your career.

Because we make more place in most weeks, we [00:08:00] make more placements than, most recruiters make all year because we're able to understand this and law firms in the market and we're committed to it. So I hope you meet these criteria. This is something I say to all my candidates, because if you don't, we typically won't work with you.

But when you do, we'll do whatever we can to work with you. You may be a candidate of ours, and you probably are aware that we send a lot of positions and and really do a lot to help our candidates. And this is what this is the rules that we follow. And and if you don't meet the criteria then we're still trying to educate you like I'm doing right now.

To do what you can to meet the criteria, because anybody at any stage of their career can get back on track and meet these criteria. And and there's a lot of ways to get positions on your own too. And I'll tell you about that. And I don't care, I how you get a job.

We certainly want you to work with us if you meet these criteria, but if you do meet these. Criteria. There's so many reasons, hundreds that you should be using a good recruiter because we can package you, make you more marketable research jobs and firms interface with law firms, prepare your applications, follow up on [00:09:00] them.

Constantly give you new positions, make recommendations that you would affirm you would never heard of, but are interested in people like you. They're not listed in directories and things. We prepare you for interviews. We scheduled them. We provide information that may not be public about the firms you're applying to negotiate your salary and give you credibility because the firms know you've been screened for these criteria when they're coming through.

And which is important. And and law firm departments also pay a lot of attention to applicants coming through us because they know we understand what they're looking for and there's fewer risk with hiring our candidates because they've been through this process where they have to meet these criteria, which anyone can do.

You don't have to work with us to meet them obviously. But what I'm gonna tell you is very important. And the fact that we charge fees is if you have these criteria, you will make the firm. Likely millions of dollars. So any fees that we charge are just none nonissue for law firms and and many law firms run their entire hiring through us.

Cause we send them candidates like this and those candidates make them money. So the way you wanna [00:10:00] position yourself too, by the way, is someone, if you're working for other people, you need to look like and be someone that's going to make money for your employer. And that's just the game.

That's what it is. And if you're not then there's other sorts of things. So we can help you with resources and things. We own law crossing some other businesses that can help you get businesses and business. We have all sorts of different resources on our website and other places that can help you.

But what happens by the way? And this is the reason I'm kinda telling you this, because you may have you may be watching this and saying, why won't BCG work me? Why is my, why won't they work with my candidacy? I've done this very well. And but here's what happens when. When you do that.

So I, as a founder of this company and someone that was committed to this profession, but also people like one of the things that anyone that's good at that's good at their jobs do. And but people that I think are exceptional of their jobs, do something else is they believe in their subject matter.

And also the [00:11:00] people they're helping. So I've believed and tens of thousands of people that didn't meet these criteria. And so I believe in people and I believe in their potential and I believe in what they could do. I see the best aspects of their background it's very meaningful to I want people to succeed and because I have memories of people that have believed in me before, and it changed my career in my life.

And so I want to believe in people. It's very important to me. That's why there's all this information on our website. That's why I'm talking to you right now is because I wanna believe people and I wanna help everyone. I'm grateful when people come to our business and I'm grateful for the firms to do business with us, and I'm grateful for the candidates.

And I'm grateful that I can help, but. And I also have a lot of respect for attorneys in the legal profession. And I love it when I think that going to law school is a big deal and it's becoming an attorney is a big deal. And trying to lift yourself up and become better is a big deal.

And and cuz not everyone does that. And when you do that, you want someone weighing on the other side, this says, congratulations, you've done all this good job and I'm gonna help you get [00:12:00] even further. And that's what we try to do. And and and you're ma and you can make a difference if I believe in you, my belief is that that you'll believe in your clients, which is important for an attorney.

And then you'll, cuz you'll learn that. And then if you believe in your clients, the world will become a better place. And this is all part of the way I think. And because clients need people to believe in them too, regardless if they're a small client or a large client. And it's part of the way the legal system works.

There's just a few people, not a lot, but there's people that have, made believed in me and and I want to pay it forward. So that's what I try to do to our candidates. The BCG is believe in them. This is not there's a lot of people that have come to this company and they see that, oh, I can do this and, become a recruiter maybe.

And they think about it in terms of money and games. And it's not what it's about. It's about it's about helping people and believing in them. And that's really what this whole game's about for me. It's not a game, but the whole. The whole profession's about for seeing people's potential is huge.

And and I love doing that. And and I do it regardless of many times the cost we've it's just, we believe in people and put [00:13:00] everything we have into them. That's why, if you're a candidate of our, you see all these firms and all the work that we're doing is because we take it extremely seriously and really want you to succeed.

But this is what happens cuz I've been doing this for so long. And you may also be a law firm watching this and and if you're a law firm watching this, I'm sure you'll agree with a lot of what I have to say. If I believe in people that I shouldn't believe in because they don't meet these six criteria, at least for representing to a law firm through BCG this is what happens.

So the first thing that happens is law firms get mad. They get mad when they see people that may be unemployed. They get mad when they see people that have too much experience, they aren't specialized. They get mad at people when they see people that are not coming from law firms and they'll send nasty notes, they will they'll talk negatively.

They'll make our employees feel badly about not sending candidates that are. To eat their criteria. And they may say rude things. I've had calls where I've sent someone to a firm [00:14:00] and they're calling me from a conference room and saying, why did you send this person? And I'll say I think they would be great for you.

They the real estate, market's very active and they're, everyone's looking for real estate attorneys. And and I know, that you may not be, but but this person has 20 years of experience and they could take over and those they'll get mad. And they'll say rude things and they get upset.

And so then they may actually, if we do that enough times, they may say, okay, now you need to follow special procedures. You need to make sure that that, and this isn't necessarily what they ask for these criteria. But they'll say something like before you said anyone, you need to do this and follow this and this.

And so this is what happens. So it just creates problems. And law firms don't wanna be bothered with bad applications. So many times through at least through recruiting firms and a bad application for them many, most times is people that don't meet those criteria. And so they get mad and and it's if you give somebody what they don't want enough times they get upset.

Imagine going to a I don't know, to a. A restaurant and saying, and ordered eggs. And the first thing they bring out is [00:15:00] ham. And they say, I didn't order ham. I order eggs. And then next time they bring out toast and say, I ordered eggs. I didn't order toast. And then they bring out orange juice and you say, I didn't order orange juice.

I just ordered eggs. That's all I ordered. So people are bringing stuff you don't want, they get mad and it doesn't help the company. And it doesn't help our future candidates. They don't understand. And it's, as I can understand why they feel that way. They may think we don't know what we're doing.

Don't understand that or wasting their time. So we have to be very careful. The other thing that happens is candidates get mad because they come to us and if we're not providing them people to meet this criteria, They will get mad at us because they won't get interviews and they won't get interviews because law firms pretty much require and they don't all do it.

But if they're looking for a permanent attorney, this is what they're looking for. And and so they get mad that they candidates get mad and then they will call and they will send me notes, make our employees feel badly. And and we risk our reputation in the market too, if we can't if people are coming to our company and they're not getting the positions they want and they're not getting any bites.

They think that we're doing something [00:16:00] wrong and they don't understand that it sees things in their background that is make them marketable. They need to spend a longer time finding positions many times because the law firms aren't gonna be interested in them and are unwilling to take to are just not interested with the background.

And it's very difficult. And the candidates may think we don't know what we're doing. If we send people like that and that we're wasting their time, not marketing them properly and not effective. And that's not good. That also hurts our reputation. If we take on people that don't make these criteria and then we of course lose time, money and law firm relationships.

Our candidates are angry. Our employees are frustrated. It hurts our revenue. We spend a lot of money trying to help people we can't and time provides less money for job research and. Building relationships and hiring more people and it puts our company at risk. And we try our best to help everyone, but when, if we're doing something, that's making everyone angry, that doesn't make a lot of sense.

And so for us this is why we need to follow these criteria. Now I am a sucker. Like I, if I talk to [00:17:00] you on the phone it doesn't matter really who you are. I will wanna help you. And I've done some crazy things, helping people. I used to, I literally used to fly around the country doing interview prep person.

I would have the candidates come to the airport, or I would, to a taxi to their house. This is when they were taxis and and do anything I could to get people jobs. I would fly from LA to wherever Atlanta up north drive to Vegas. Whatever it took to get someone a job and I'm very motivated by it.

And and and the exceptions are great. But for most of the time, it, even though I'm very passionate about it, it doesn't do it a lot of good and it's unfortunate. The main thing is we can't be in business to upset people and it doesn't make sense to.

Proactively put ourselves in a position we're upsetting our law firm, clients, candidates, and our own employees. And we're just not in business to make people upset or throw people, throw money away. And you have to understand that law firms need to make money off you. So if you have these six criteria, which I'm gonna break down and they're actually, [00:18:00] if you break the individual ones down, there's about 10 of 'em.

But if you don't make these criteria, then they're gonna be concerned. They can't make make money off you. And that's what I'm gonna explain below. And for us, we have to invest our time and money as well. And if law firms won't pay us to hire you then then, then we're not gonna give good service to them either.

And again, we have lots of tools and resources to help people that we can help and businesses that we've started that help people, but not as necessarily your direct age just that's the only thing we can do. And our number one core values to give people jobs. So everyone that comes to our company has benefited but just, and we do get everyone jobs if they follow our advice, but, and good jobs, better jobs than they would without finding us most of the time.

But but just not obvious in the way you respect. So these are the 10 reasons. I'm, they're actually six, but I've taken those six and broken them down. And what I'm telling you right now Help you so much. And I'm actually very glad to do this because this is what you need to do to get a job in a law firm.

And this is not what they teach you [00:19:00] anywhere. They don't teach you this in law school. They don't teach you this, and you're not gonna learn this anywhere else. You probably can learn. It is, this is my experience from doing nothing but law firm investments working with over, the history of this company.

Over 10% of the attorney in the United States and having more than half of the attorneys in the United States apply to work with us and working with a lot of people over the history of. Company. So this is going to help you a lot. And this is just all based on statistics.

What I've seen, what works, what doesn't work, this is what you need to do to be a marketable attorney. So there's 10 reasons and using BCG. If you meet these 10 criteria whether or not you use BCG or PI or on your own, you are going to be marketable and be able to get a job. And, but you need to understand them.

And there's reasons behind each of them. And they're very important. If I was you, I would watch this. This is the kind of thing I would watch again and again, because there's so much information here and I [00:20:00] don't want you to miss any of it, but I'm gonna explain it to you break down right away.

So these are the six reasons that I've broken out 10, again, being applied full time, have stability working in the law office, law firm, a single primary practice area, or just a few related practice areas. Typically you need to be us citizen hopefully with a JD degree from the United States.

That means no people. You're not really marketable if you just get an LM and you're from another country you need to be admitted at the bar or be able to this is moving laterally in the state you wanna work in you have to have between one years of experience or if you have more portable business or be in a very difficult time practice area.

And these are what I call the 10 reasons. I always list six because it's a little bit easier, but when you look at, when you break it down, there's really 10 reasons. So the first one you shouldn't use BCG if you're unemployed and I'm gonna go through each of these individually and these are 10 reasons right here.

And I I don't know, I guess I'll just read them off for you real quickly. So you understand them but then I'll go into little more detail. So the [00:21:00] first one is if you're unemployed you typically that's something that makes it very difficult for employers to hire you. I'll talk more about in a minute.

But and there are certainly exceptions to that. But typically if you're unemployed, it's very difficult because there's so many questions surrounding why you might be unemployed, that they can't answer that most law firms aren't gonna take a risk. If you're not in a law firm and you're in another practice setting, which means government.

In house and so forth. Most law firms are not gonna be that interested in you. And I hate to say it. I'm sorry. But that's just what it is. The next one is if you're not working full time as an associate partner or counsel then most of the time you're gonna have a very difficult time being marketable.

If you're, part-time trying to get a full-time position. If you're not a United States citizen or don't have a S J D it's very difficult to be marketable. If you don't have employment stability, meaning if you look like you move around too much, that's not gonna help you. Or if you work in house, no law firm and back in house, and then back in a law firm or in the government that's difficult.

If you don't work in a single [00:22:00] primary practice area, so law firms want specialists, not generalists smaller markets, like the smallest of the markets. They may hire generalists, but most of the time not you shouldn't, you should, again, one to six years of experience. If you have more than six years of experience, you either need business or you need to you, you need to be in a specialized practice area.

And then and then again, if you're not admitted with the bar in state, you're trying to work. So that means you can't just decide if you're living in Chicago to move to LA, unless you have the bar, you can't do it. It's, people are not for the most part going to heart. So this is, and again, what I'm talking about is BCG only does law firm placement.

This is about getting a permanent law firm job. So each of these 10 reasons I'm gonna discuss in more detail right now are about getting a permanent law firm job. So the first one is you shouldn't be using us or whether any legal placement firm, if you're unemployed you're typically not gonna be marketable if you're not currently employed full time somewhere.

The reason is is because it does. And unfortunately I don't like this but most law [00:23:00] firms have a lot of experience hiring people and they know that there's certain people that are likely to work out and certain people that aren't, and they're very cautious. Now you can sometimes get into an upstart law firm and other things, if you're unemployed, I there's our exceptions to this, but if you're not employed, there's a presumption.

It's not always true, but that you were fired for performance issues because and the law firm will, another law firm will never say you were fired most of the time. They won't say he was fired or she was fired but there's a presumption that you were fired or you had personality conflicts, and just didn't get along.

And so you quit. There's people that go into firms and think that they're better than the firm, or they understand it or they're not doing things right. So they need to quit. Whatever. And the law firms don't like that. Or if you have personality conflicts, they, most of the time I talk to people all the time.

They had a personality conflict at one firm. Then they go to another firm and they talk about another personality conflict, or they don't like how things were done. Then they go to a third firm, it's the same thing. So law firms understand that and they know [00:24:00] that if you're unemployed, this is likely to be an issue.

And or sometimes I think you were worried about getting fired, cuz you may have done something wrong, but they don't know and multiple other reasons. But all of those reasons, if you're unemployed scare law firms, they don't like it. And so if there's more people that they could hire for the same job that are employed, they will.

And and I will tell you that I have placed plenty of people that have been unemployed. So I'm not saying it's possible, but it makes it a lot harder. And and and it can really especially in large cities. So if you're in a city like New York and you lose your job for your unemployed, it's gonna be very difficult for you to get a front job in New York.

Now, if you're have some rare skills, like you're doing corporate MNA and stuff, you could probably move to a smaller market. Like you might be able to get a job in. A lot of smaller markets up north, in Northern, upstate New York or maybe other states and small markets, but you're gonna have a very difficult time in a big market because you're just gonna have a lot of applicants and, you can take a new maternity leave that's [00:25:00] acceptable.

And we PI place people like this on a regular basis, but you have to have for the most part, very rare hard to find skills in the market you're looking at. So if you're fired in Chicago and you're doing international tax, and then you wanna go to smaller market and do international tax, you can probably get a job doing that smaller market, but it's not gonna be something it's, you're typically going to have very rare skills.

And because you're anything that's gonna bring your performance into question is problematic. So you have to remember that this is one of the most important pieces of advice and the attorney can have is that you never wanna be searching for a job unemployed. If you're unemployed your opportunities to be in a position are like 10 times, it's gonna be 10 times more difficult especially in the market you're in and the market you're in will be like 50 times.

If you wanna go to a smaller market and you're unemployed, it can, it's not as hard, but but but it's, again, if we're working with unemployed attorney, unless they're trying to use our power to. Look for something nationally. It could be extremely difficult and I've seen so many [00:26:00] sad stories about people that were unemployed, having hard time finding a job, and some partners get fired or walk off the job and spend years finding jobs and get divorced.

And this is all sorts of problems. And so you have to be very careful and you don't want to draw suspicion to your background because these are questions that can't answer. So there, if there is something that a lot of young attorneys don't understand and it's essentially this.

So every old attorney was a young attorney once. And so because an old attorney was a young attorney. Once those old attorneys will realize that, people make mistakes when they're young and do dumb things. And so they, most attorneys are not gonna talk negatively about another attorney in their performance, but being unemployed is the.

The statement. So it's not, so I've seen people I had a situation once where I was very funny. I was, it was a really good firm. It was really good New York firm. And this girl had gone insane and been hospitalized and just had all these serious mental [00:27:00] issues. And that had nothing to do with her job.

And she'd only been on the job like six months or eight months. And so I called, she said, you can call the firm for arm. So I called the partner she worked with, and you said glowing recommendation had nothing negative to say and say anything about her problems and and and or anything.

And her performance was horrible when she was there. So most law firms are not gonna say negative things, but they know that that when there's, when you're unemployed there's probably something bad there. So most law firms will choose the employed attorney. You're just a big risk if you're unemployed.

So be very careful about being unemployed. Most law firms that are hiring you we'll assume it was your fault. And in their experience, when they do hire unemployed attorneys, there's just new problems and new performance issues at the new employer I've hired. I used to at BCG I used to hire lots of our candidates that what I was working with and I'd be talking to someone that was from like a top firm and they were unemployed and I'd be like, this is horrible.

I can't believe that, this super prestigious firm you're not working there and you [00:28:00] lost your job. And when I would hire those people, they would always come to our company and there would be problems with them later. And they would either fire our company or they would meaning, do this big public episode with quitting and, or they would end up getting fired.

There's a lot of problems with unemployed people from the firm standpoint, I don't like to go into a lot of detail with it, but I just want you to understand that if you leave a job, if you leave a job without a new job, if you decide you can quit and get another job, you're really creating problems.

If you don't wanna be in the legal, if you wanna work in a law firm. Most law firms will are not interested in using outside agencies to find unemployed attorneys. And unless again, there's something exceptional about your background. And so if you're unemployed you just need to make sure that you have an outstanding explanation for why you're unemployed.

Those explanations can be things related to needing to move home, not cuz of a sick parent. They can be The firm that your entire practice group left and went to another firm. But they didn't take any associates. They couldn't. But whatever [00:29:00] explanation you give, you need to be able to convince the law firms was through no fault to your own.

You do great work, you work hard team player a lot more than anything. So this is some of the things. And then you need to frame an explanation that makes it look like it has nothing to do with you and that your performance is really good. And then, we have a bunch of resources that we can use.

If we don't work with you, one would be law crossing. It's again, the point of this. Is not to prop up other businesses, but what law crossing does is it essentially will show you every position out there. That's public on any other website. And then we'll also allow employers to push jobs for free what that means.

And it's different than other websites, because other websites are only showing things that other people are paying to post. So there's a lot more positions on there than and if site works for you, it's very inexpensive. I think you enjoy it for a dollar a week or something. And then you can we have a lot of career resources and articles and things that discuss unemployment on law, crossing BCG.

There's also a lot of forums. We have another site called top law school where there's a ton of forums. It's always important to try to talk to other thing. And then of course you [00:30:00] have webinars like this one that can help you as well. And then and then, and the other one is too is working part-time.

That, and that's a real danger too. And a lot of people. There's nothing wrong with wanting a good style of life or wanting to not be working full time, but if you're working part-time a lot of times the law firms will believe that you don't wanna work full-time or the law firm doesn't have enough work, but it wants to give you due to the quality of the work, or you just have other priorities.

And those other priorities can be whatever. I in the few cases where I've had full-time employees, I've made them part-time. I typically did that because I knew they weren't putting in a good effort when they were full-time where they weren't doing good work. And I wanted them, there's tons of reasons that people put people on part-time.

But if they walk, firms want people that are going to give it their all, they don't make money when you're working part-time and it undermines the people around you in the firm. So they don't like it now. That's of course there's people working. Part-time. mean, It's not necessarily to say that you can't get there and eventually work part-time, but you're gonna have [00:31:00] a very hard time getting a position.

If you apply to the firms and say, I wanna work part. They do not like that. They will not like it. And and because they make money, when when, instead of working the required 1500 or 1800 or 2000 hours, you work 2,600 hours and this is what they want. They wanna have someone that's committed with a prospect of advancement.

And and they just don't, they want people it just undermines the whole system. That's not to say you can't work part-time and get jobs, but that's just not a hot commodity, someone that wants to work. Part-time most of the time people that are trying to work part-time believe, prioritize a personal act, which is perfectly fine.

I'm not, I don't have the problem with that, but for a firm the firm wants people that are available when they get busy, they wanna be able to hire people and and they wanna be your, they wanna be your. They want to be the most important thing in your life. Fortunately but even the smallest firms, they want, they wanna be a priority.

You need, if you're not working full-time and you're working [00:32:00] part-time you just need to make it look like you really want part-time work. Maybe the firm has lost a big client. Maybe there's something wrong, or I don't know, but you, the firm needs to understand that's interviewing you that maybe you're leaving because there's just not enough work or that the firm's not bringing in work or they they, they laid everyone off, but they kept me part-time because they didn't wanna lose me.

Something along those lines and you need to make it look like, that you are committed or maybe you are on part-time because you have child brew or parent responsibilities or something, but those are going to go away. And then you wanna be full-time you have to have some sort of explanation.

And again, I'm not I'm not judging this stuff, and I'm not saying one of these things it's bad that law firms wanna, they expect you to work full time. I'm just telling you what they're looking at and what they're going to react. So if you have a job that you need say you have if I'm just giving you an example, but say you need someone to take care of a sick parent.

Full [00:33:00] time living in your house and change their oxygen every three hours. I don't know. But just someone, something like that. And then someone applies and says, I can do it, but I can only do it. Part-time so is that okay? You're probably gonna say no. I need someone that's here all week while I'm at work.

I don't need, this is crazy. Like how can I don't want to have to, and that's how law firms think too. So you need to be able to have a convincing argument for why you're working part-time and then, again, these are just some other explanations. I don't highlight whatever you're saying, your explanation for working part-time needs to be that your their work is very well received.

You're good at practicing law. You're hungry. You like to work hard, the works your life. And again, I'm not judging any of this and saying that you have to believe in this. This is, but this is what you need to do. If you wanna work at a firm and you need to, it needs to be very, these need to be very good explanations.

And then then people get fired all the time and that's Another thing that happens. And when that happens, sometimes you can just be honest and [00:34:00] people will, if they need you, they will take pity on you. But you typically do not wanna talk about that if you can and avoid it, just say it wasn't a good situation.

There were some things going on there that I, I don't know, but you don't want, you typically need to be very classy about that and let your experience speak for itself. So another reason you shouldn't be using a recruiter in most cases, if you're not currently working in a law firm.

People come to us all the time from in-house the government academia in law school which is or recent graduates. You typically this is for recent graduate. You typically need in order for a law firm to be interested in laterally, you typically need at least six months of experience, more likely more than a year.

But if you're coming from other practice settings, especially if you don't have any law firm training, or also if you have left a law firm and gone in house or gone into one of these other settings, just think about it from the the law firm's point of view, they're gonna believe that you're going to leave again that you didn't like a law firm, or if you don't have the training, they're gonna believe that you don't understand how things work in a law firm and therefore, [00:35:00] why would we hire you?

If you were from a law firm, they're gonna think that you were not committed to it. So if you're not committed to it, why would they hire. That would be a very bad mistake if you were, if you went and did a clerkship, that's okay. But sometimes, they're gonna prefer that you maybe did the clerkship before you started practicing because leaving while you're practicing and coming back can also look like a risk.

Law firms want people directly from law firms and that's just because it's the billable hours the accountability, the work quality, the working clients the way that works done at certain types of law firms, like the largest law firms have certain standards, the smaller law firms that all those things translate into a good hire because they can make predictions about you based on that.

So if again, working in a big law firm or getting a job in any size law firm is if you're, it means you're a proven commodity. And if you're coming from a law firm, if you're coming from another practice setting, that's completely different. It's not a law firm. You may say [00:36:00] my I work inhouse and is very good inhouse department law firms don't know that they sure as hell know what it means to come from Morrison Forrester, or or a firm like that.

I They know what that means, but they don't know what it means to come from the in-house department of whatever. Insurance. It's, they don't know. There's certain exceptions sometimes, federal judicial clerks are definitely marketable through recruiters even.

Yes, but but most of the time they expect them to even have had a summer associate job and and and be exceptional. But in most cases law firms want attorneys from pure law firms other than clerkships. Even if you're coming out of a prestigious clerkship, like a circuit park clerkship or something most law firms, it's a better risk for them to hire someone coming from a law firm because working for a judge is not the same thing as working in a law firm.

Law firms are political there's there's our requirements. There's it's just different. But, and again, you're not approving trained commodity for the law firm. But someone coming from a peer firm is there's just something to think about. [00:37:00] I clerked and but, and. I thought it was an incredible experience and I, it was something I probably needed.

I probably, would've not done as well. I worked for a judge that gave me a lot of very good habits. And, but again it's not the same, it's come from a law firm. So if you're not currently working in a law firm, you need to have an explanation for what qualifies you to work in a law firm.

Why you wanna work in a law firm. You need to have explanations that discuss why your experience qualifies you to work in a law firm. You need to be really on top of that. People, by the way I do get people positions all the time every month from clerkships, from in different practice settings.

But it's very difficult. You have to, typically you can move from accounting firms to a law firm using a recruiter. If you have very rare skills, like you might be doing a RSA or something, or you can move in house, if you have very rare skills and you're doing one thing, but there's other reasons which I'll get into later in this, why people from other practice settings are.[00:38:00]

Risky. So typically law firms also want they wanna hire people that are associates or partners or counsel is okay sometimes, but generally associates are partners. If you're a staff attorney, a contract attorney, paralegal, clerk, or title, other than an attorney law firms will assume that you didn't want a title position or you weren't offered one.

And and that concerns them. So they they'll say, okay I wonder why this person is, do they're applying for a $250,000 year job, but yet they're working someplace for $60 an hour. I wanna understand, that they don't like it. And the staff attorney, same thing, like they don't understand, why would you work as a staff attorney as opposed to an associate or partner?

It's just it's suggests a level of commitment. That's not as high. And it also suggests a lack of maybe that the firm doesn't have enough faith that you'll stick around. So I see people by the way, I'm not saying that. [00:39:00] It's bad to be a staff attorney, bad to be a contract attorney.

I see staff attorneys and contract attorneys. I saw one yesterday from Yale law school that had worked at a, one of the top five firms in the country. I saw, I see them from Harvard law school almost every day. So when I, cuz I review candidates every day and so I, again, lots of people make these choices consciously.

They can be great attorneys that have worked in huge firms and have good experience with it's just their choice. But again, once they've made that choice, future law firms are gonna assume that person is not interested in working as a, as an attorney as an associate and they're too much of a risk they're just not committed and that's okay.

There's nothing wrong with that. I'm not judging that, but that makes you very difficult to get a job as a full-time associate or partner, which is what we do at our company. And and then if we have these other titles and council attorneys are also sometimes marked, but again, council, while it's a good job.

And and at certain firms it's. Mark of honor to be council. It's [00:40:00] a huge deal, but it does suggest a lack of commitment or a lack of business sometimes or the ability to really commit. So it's, you're just not as marketable. You're not trying to be a partner. You're not trying to commit at the same level, so you're not as marketable.

So your other options, if you don't have one of these titles are typically to have a good explanation you can have all sorts of explanations. They can say something along the lines of I didn't wanna take a full-time position here because I wanted to move to a larger firm, but I was doing a favor for a friend or partner that I know, or there's all sorts of explanations, but if you don't have a good explanation then you have to be careful and and and law firms if you do have a different title are gonna believe that you.

You really wanna be an associate partner and the reasons that you have this other title. So law firms are smart too. There's all sorts of ways that law firms will all sorts of titles. That law firms will give people. They'll call them like a managing associates instead of associate. And that's not a real associate, they'll call them an attorney or they'll call them.

And again, there's nothing wrong with these positions, but [00:41:00] if you have one of 'em, then the law firms are gonna assume that you don't wanna full-time one, or you are working somewhere where the law firm doesn't think you merit it. And typically the people that are staff attorneys and contract attorneys and things, aren't doing the same type of work that the associates are.

Aren't had the same hourly standards requirement to work, same hours don't have the same reviews aren't can be considered for mobility. There's just problems they want for associates and partners. They want the most motivated people and they wanna basically hold them out is this is our product of our, what it looks like to have our best people working on your matter.

And and then they charge for it accordingly. If you don't have that you can certainly you can apply to firms that hire a lot of people aren't working full-time and if you're parttime seeking a position, you can also try to apply to other positions in law firms, but that, those but that's, know, again, that's just something to be careful about.

You should also not be using BCG if you if you're not a United States citizen or [00:42:00] you don't have a United a JD now there's people that have qualifications to work in law firms. But but that are maybe from foreign countries, but law firms think it's a big risk. I've had lots of people that have gotten hired by firms and then the firms are offers and then the firms find out that sponsorship and they're just no longer interested.

And unless the law firm has there's a shortage of people in the market that to do the type of work. And there are periods in history where that's happened. It's happened. It happened in the two thousands and 2001. There was a lot of people from foreign attorneys that hired New York and bay area and the corporate work.

And but it's very rare. And and then you get 2012, 13. There was some, it's just there. So it happens, but it's just, you have to be And even recently it's happened a little bit, but you have to realize that it's a big risk, unless you have some sort of experience that is just not available in the market.

Why would they hire someone that requires visas and could leave and put the relationships with [00:43:00] their clients at risk when you leave? And that is going to upset the apple cart. And it's just not, it's not a good business move. Sometimes they'll hire LMS for one year and some sort of foreign associate program, but most firms are just not interested in it.

Think about what you would do if you were if you were running a firm, would you wanna hire all sorts of people from a foreign country to work for you when that you have to get them visas and you don't know if they're gonna leave and they'll go home when to see their family, they'll miss them.

You don't know, and it's a risk now. I actually think it's smart for law firms. A lot of times to hire foreign attorneys because it's so difficult for them to get hired that they are likely to stay, which is the, one of the biggest problems of, for, in a lot of practice here is my opinion. But but at the same time that's just what it's and then getting an LM all sorts of people.

It's. Huge business for law schools allowing foreign attorneys to come over for a year and sit in class and to collect a huge amounts of fees. And and I think the M's very good for people cuz it can [00:44:00] take the us bar, but it doesn't mean you're gonna be able to get hired necessarily by a law firm.

You have to be very careful. And now if you get a JD, that's a, it's a little different and foreign attorneys can get JDS. LMS are good. It allows you to take the bar, but it's very difficult to get a job in the us. So your other options there are some firms that will hire you once you pass the bar.

If I was an LM, I would look up firms that have just LLMs from foreign countries working in them. And if they do have them, then those would be places that you might be able to get a position. And a lot of law firms will hire people as a temporary role. If you do a good job, those can be convert into something else.

But again, there's, they're worried about them leaving and they do leave. Most of the time a lot of the attorneys will not stay a long period of time. There's a lot of expense and hassle of visas and many times their experience is not compatible to the law. Firm's work. I had this instance where I was an firm that actually hired some foreign attorneys and and they had hired this one person from Asian country.

[00:45:00] That had passed the bar and very smart, but this particular person was having couldn't understand the industry in the federal and state system. It had been in, multiple meetings where they were trying to explain the difference between federal law and state law and how that applied and for whatever reason that person didn't pick up on.

I don't know why, but person frankly, was very smart, but but you need to prepare to explain all these kind of questions. If if a law firm's trying to hire you, why you're gonna stay, why they should invest in you, why your experience is compatible. And but it's very difficult.

In most cases it doesn't work and they will take a risk on you and they will, if they think you'll stick around and there are ones law firms do it all the time, but it's really for them, I think too much of a risk and they will do it mainly with corporate. But and they may hire you if they think you're gonna commit.

And you're unlikely to leave. And many times they're also interested in the potential for you to give the business in the future as well. And then the next one the fifth thing is stability. So stability means that you're committed to working in a law firm, any given market, any given practice area.

And it looks that you're [00:46:00] gonna settle down and make it work wherever you go. If you don't have employment stability work in a law firm, you probably shouldn't be using a recruiter and it's gonna make it much more difficult for you to be marketable. Stability is a big thing. The most marketable attorneys all have stability, and it's just it's something that that when you're young especially, or people will move a lot.

But if you look like you move a lot the law firm is gonna consider you a risk because if someone's been at they were at one firm for a year, then they've been at another firm for a year, and now they're looking again. The odds are almost certain that the third firm that hires 'em, they're only gonna be at a year, two or six months, or they'll stay like a year and a half that you just won't.

And it's just, this is what always happens. It's and then they may go try something else, which is okay. And I will say that a lot of times people just get the firm environment wrong firm culture matters, and the type of people you're working with matters, and you will be happy to the extent you find the right environment.

Some people never do and leave the practice of law for that reason. So that's one of the reasons when I'm working with [00:47:00] people, I recommend, especially if you're looking for a new job, you should talk to every possible place you can, because you need to understand you need to find the right culture, cuz you can walk into places and know that things will click.

I. When I first, I've met people before and I'm like, I'm gonna have a great relationship with this person. I just see them. And I talk to 'em for 10 seconds and I understand it. And same thing with firms it's and I don't, I've met people 35 years or 40 years ago just that I met and I clicked it right away.

And actually I can think of someone I met, it's just when I was a, young child. So it's, so things works. But if you've done things like you've switched locations where you work, that's a big deal. So if you go from one market to another that, why did you do that? Are you gonna stay there?

If you've switched practice settings that's not stable. So that means you've worked in a law firm. Then you went in the government. Now you wanna come back or you worked in the government. Now you wanna work in a law firm. That's not good. The locations locations by the way are good when you're going home.

So that's, if you are from if you're [00:48:00] working in say you're working in Cleveland and you're from. I don't know, Chicago, and you want to go home to work in a firm there firms love that because that's suggest stability. So anything that you do that suggests stability is very helpful. But practice settings if you switched employers often, if there's gaps of unemployment, if you have a lot of moves or uh, UN otherwise look unstable, that's not good.

Law firms, if you switch practice here, sometimes people will say, oh, I'm doing this practice here. And I really don't like it. I wanna do this. And is if that's going to make them happy. It usually does. So if law firms don't think you have stability your risk, they're just going to hire someone that does you would too.

So that's just how it works. You would too. So if you don't have stability you need to do a couple things. So the first is if you're doing a job search, you should talk to every type of firm and every type of practice setting or every, every type of that you can not necessarily practicing, but every size firm and so forth and see if you like that.

If you're [00:49:00] still unhappy and you don't have a good explanation, you should, you can consider many times, what is the reason for these moves? And sometimes it's just, you need to get, have a few bad experiences to have a good one. And but it's very rare. I Once you've.

Had, a certain number of if you're unable to commit someplace it's usually a problem. And and it's I've it's interesting. I tell the story all the time, but when I started in recruiting which was a long time ago my first two hires were one woman that had practiced or had been in her law firm working.

I think she was a recruiting coordinator for 15 years and the next person had been that her firm, like eight years as an attorney, those are my first two hires. And the one that had been there 15 years lasted maybe 17 or 18 years at our firm. And the one that had been there for eight years lasted maybe 12 years.

And in the interim, I hired probably 50 people that have been one year, two years, [00:50:00] three years of places. And none of them lasted longer than their last position. They. For a year, they would figure out they had to leave or after six months, if they left, it's just, people are wired a certain way.

So some certain people will go someplace and they'll make it work. People tried new things. Typically doesn't work either. If you've done new things or tried it or moved, or you need to have some robust explanations about why you're gonna be committed to wherever you go next, because that's extremely important because if you're, if you don't have good explanations the employers need to think you're gonna stick around if they hire you.

And if they don't believe that then what, then they're gonna, then that's not good. So they may need people to do the work in the short run, but they know it's a risk. And and I know when I look at a resume and I'm talking to someone how likely they're to stick around the other thing, this is a big one is that you really shouldn't be you, your resume needs to look like you, you work in a single primary practice area.

And and this I could talk about this forever. I spoke about this a couple weeks ago and I think that this is [00:51:00] incredibly important. The reason this is important is because law firms hire specialist and I'm generalist. So a lot of times if I'm like, say I'm. An attorney like people do the dumbest things on their resumes and they don't know that they're dumb.

So it's not that they know they're dumb, but they do things that are dumb. So one of the big things that a lot of times people will do is they think I'm, I'm gonna show people that I'm really committed, law firms, that I'm a good person and really committed to pro bono. So the list, all this pro bono stuff.

So oftentimes before they talk about the fact that they're a securities attorney, don't say represented engine and did this and helped this person and this group. And no law firms do not like to see that, because that means that you have other priorities that they'll say, or the, or a litigator will say I worked on a corporate transaction and I also filed a trademark and helped out with this and this.

No, no law firms don't like that. Or they'll say I was a criminal defense attorney. [00:52:00] Now I'm a litigator. And before that I was a trademark attorney or so, no, no law firms. They wanna see stability in one practice area. So if you have a bunch of stuff you're talking about on your resume, besides the one practice area, no, then you not like that makes it look like you don't know what you wanna do.

And clients hire specialists, clients hire they don't, they may in small markets, hire people. General skills, but no, you're more valuable if you are committed to one thing. So the more specialized you are the better and they wanna see it as a pattern. So if you started out your career doing personal injury law, and now, seven years later after two moves, you're doing IP litigation.

You sure as heck, do not wanna talk about you just put down the name of the firm you worked at and say, you're an associate, you don't have to say anything else about the fact that you were doing criminal law because people [00:53:00] look for the if I'm hiring a If I'm hiring someone to take care of my kids.

And I see some and say some manies and his last three jobs have been working as an auto mechanic and a bouncer and a bar. And then his most recent job is working as a bouncer and also helping out his sister with her kids on the weekends. No way, right? I'm not, there's no way I'm gonna hire this guy to watch my kids and take care of my baby or whatever.

No, it's not happening. So you have to look like you're a fit for the job you do. Not. Those law firms do not wanna see. And I'm gonna pound this into your whatever you do. They do not. They are not impressed at all with multiple practice areas or multiple things you're doing, they wanna see a laser focus and the more laser focus you are the better.

That's all there is to it. You will not look committed. [00:54:00] They will it's. I don't even know what to say. But more stuff you list on your resume that has nothing to do with what the law firm opening is the you're in bad shape. So if a law firm's looking for someone to do healthcare transactional work, and you list on your resume that you do.

Maybe you say I've done healthcare litigation, I've done insurance defense, and I've also done some, a few healthcare contracts and trans no. You talk about transactional work. And then if your last job was just doing healthcare litigation, you just put healthcare associate. You don't, you have to be very careful about this stuff.

And this one thing screws up so many careers. There's so many jobs. If you are a lateral attorney, like there are so many jobs that you probably haven't gotten because you have not done this correctly. Law firms want specialist, did you not want, now they may want a corporate attorney that can do M and a and general court, but that's fine.

Or even in some [00:55:00] markets, but they're not gonna want people to do lots of different things. They hate it and they are not impressed. I'm just. Wanna be flat out with you. They are not impressed. They do not think it's. If you are a general commercial litigator and applying to a personal injury firm, no, they're not impressed because you're not a personal injury attorney.

Now that doesn't mean you can't do it, but who would they hire? All things considered. If they have someone that's personal injury attorney that has the same law school and the same, they're gonna hire the personal injury attorney. So they just, that you have to have commitment. You have to look like you have experience in a practice area and you have to look every highly compensated, the most highly compensated partners in the country.

That the ones that regardless of they're working on their own, or they're working on the law firm, they're all in typically one practice area. They're not doing multiple things. And so if you are, you have to clean up your resume and do it now, because I don't know what to say, but if I look at your resume and you talk about doing five or six different things, [00:56:00] I'm like, what the heck?

No. No, no one wants that the law firms will not hire it. Now that's not to say that if you do litigation, you've done 10 different types of litigation. And it's, but you have to look focused, especially to the jobs. And the smartest thing you can do by the way I am is when you are applying to jobs you need to make sure that your resume speaks about the practice area and emphasizes the practice area, the job you're applying to, if you have, if you are a generalist It's going to be much harder because no, one's going to know what you're interested in.

It's again, if I hire someone to paint my house and the person shows up and they talk about how they have a lot of experience as a I

waiter and they also have experience cleaning cars. This is what people do all the time. They, they put stuff on their resume that has nothing to do with the job they're applying for, or they talk about all these different things and and it hurts them. And and it's one of those [00:57:00] biggest causes of failures.

I, I would say again, I look at resumes all day long. When I get off this webinar, I will probably go look at resumes. And when I look at them, I will look at maybe, over the next couple hours, I'll look at maybe 200 resumes of people that have applied while I'm talking to you. And and out of those 200, I will probably see no more than 20 10% of the resumes that are focused on a practice area.

And those 10% are probably all gonna be marketable and they will get jobs and they will have they, but most people don't do this. I don't know why. Again, no one tells 'em to do not to do this, but they think it's a big deal and the dumbest thing, and I wanna. Please listen to me, like the dumbest thing that people do is talk about stuff on their resume and their current experience that just has nothing to do with the type of job you're applying for.

I, I started seeing all these resumes. I don't know what it is that all they do is talk about other pro bono experience, [00:58:00] what the heck, and these people don't get hired and then they're mad, or they talk about their their commitment to all these groups. I don't care what the group is. It could be the Democrats or the Republicans or the NRA or whatever, but the resume is littered with descriptions of I saw one resume.

Talk about someone's. But anyway they mentioned something like I saw one resume mentioned I couldn't believe it 30 times, and I'm not gonna say what it was. It was an affinity group, but it was an affinity group that, some people, half the population thinks is cool. The other half probably doesn't.

And I, I couldn't believe it. I mention it 30 times. It talked about how, remember this affinity group in college. And they remember this affinity group in law school, and they remember this affinity group at their law firm. And they're part of an affinity group task force at their law firm. And then they wrote some papers about this affinity group.

And then they were in this affinity organizations in addition to that, and then they were doing pro bono for this affinity group. And I'm like, what the hell? Like all people are trying to do is hire an attorney and like you're hitting them over the head with the fact that, you have [00:59:00] to make your resume about your practice here.

It's really important. And and again, all this information you're getting from people. It there's nothing wrong. Like when I went to college, I was became very interested in diversity and I wrote books about it. I told classes about it and I'm very interested in and at some point someone said you're not a member of any the, but that, but the point is that.

Like I was very interested in it. But and I understand, and I think a lot of colleges and universities and stuff the professors will give you a lot of belief that these groups and things, and that this, anything that you know is important and it is important. And it, but it's personal to you.

It's not your, a resume is a professional document. And it's something you're trying to get a job working for someone being committed to that particular type of job. And and if you are, if your commitment lies elsewhere, that's going to scare the firms a little bit. You have to make sure that your resume looks like [01:00:00] that's what you're committed to.

And again, your practice here is the most important thing, but you cannot litter your resume with all the stuff about stuff that has nothing to do with what you're doing. There's nothing wrong being interested in it. But you have to be very careful because those resumes don't get hired. And because they don't get hard, now they may get a, they may get in the door for their first job or something, but they typically have a very hard time after that.

And then the people with those resumes become very angry and then they're, then they don't get jobs and then their careers just go off elsewhere. And so I don't like that. And I, again, this is from someone I've written books about diversity. I think it's great. And I'm not just seeing diversity, I'm saying any type of diversity, whether it's political diversity or I D.

Sexual or racial way. It doesn't matter. I It's all important, but these are, you don't go to a cocktail party and announce your, your your Democrat or Republican or whatever, you have to be very careful. So I just, everything needs to be about that one practice here.

And I, I don't know how else to [01:01:00] say it. And I just urge you him very careful, because if you don't people I just, I hate it because job is to get a job. And so this stuff hurts you. I don't act badly. And so you need to be careful. It doesn't matter where you're applying. Even if the people seeing this are on your side, and most of them are like, they still want to hire people to do a job that are committed to the job.

And and if you talk about nothing but things don't have to do with the job on your resume. It too much it's gonna scare them. And then one to six years of experience working in a law firm, it's really one to six, but it could be more, it could be more than one to 10, but they don't hire law students.

You can't use a recruiter to get a job as a law student, you can't even get one, use a recruiter. If you're a recent graduate, it just doesn't work. They're they're hiring people that have experience preferably in one practice area and. And they're very difficult when they're more than six years, unless they have portable business, [01:02:00] which a lot of people do by the way, when they start getting six, seven years of experience, or they're in a rare, hard define practice area.

Now a rare, hard define practice area. It doesn't always mean real estate or corporate or patent. It could be litigation. Sometimes litigation becomes a very rare or a specialized form of litigation. But you have to have some sort of experience to get a permanent job for a recruiter.

And it has to typically be at least a year. And the reason it's difficult once you get too much experience once you get more than six years of experience, because at that point you're expected to be on the partnership track. Now there are firms where it takes 10 to 12 years to become a partner.

So they will hire laterals at eight or nine or 10 sometimes. But for the most part once you become more senior, your billing rates increase to a level that is closer to. Partners. And so it's harder for law firms to give you work. And because their, your billing rate partners make more money when they do their own work.

And so as your billing rate gets higher that partners have to give you work instead of [01:03:00] themselves. So they're gonna make less money. Not only that, but the, if the client sees a billing rate, that's very close to the partner and it's not a partner to an associate. They don't like that. So the part they prefer the partner to do it.

So there's all sorts of dynamics going on there. And then also when they bring you in as a more senior attorney, you're suddenly competing with people that may have been summer associates there for a chance of partnership. And and that kind of upsets the apple cart as well. And the law firms don't like to do that.

So tho those are some of the reasons now it doesn't mean that every firm does that, but it's typically the, that's the reason. So your other options are you have to be able to explain why the law firm can benefit from hiring you of course, but and if you've had less than one year of experience what happens to attorneys all the time is and it's very common at lower ranked law schools.

People typically will often not get hired for a permanent job until they pass the bar. And so they're a bar they're called a law clerk before then the higher ranked law schools, people will get hired paid a full time salary and stuff without having passed the bar yet. But and then you have.[01:04:00]

Other people that just don't find a job right away. And and then and so if you haven't found a job in your first year and you've had interviews and so forth, you just need to, typically what this is the advice and you start out people, most people start out applying to the very best firms thinking they might have some luck there.

And then they start applying to you just need to apply to move down the line until you get to the smaller consumer face and you always get hired. There's always law firms that hire people. I encounter them all the time. They don't. They don't necessarily use recruiters, but they hire the hire people that need experience.

And but you need, if you if you've have less than one year of experience and you work in a law firm after the bar, you just need to prepare to explain any reasons, that you may be searching for a move and or why you're searching. If you've been at a firm for less than a year, people do start looking for jobs after six months and so forth.

This is just a piece of advice. Most attorneys do not know what they're doing in any law firm until they've had at least a year or two of experience. So what happens to young [01:05:00] attorneys is they often get psyched out because they're getting their work aggressively critiqued as a young attorney.

And they don't like that. And and so they feel like there's something maybe wrong with the firm or they feel ashamed and they, and so it, you need to spend a couple years learning what you're doing until you until you're ready to at least a year, till you get of comfortable in most practice areas to become proficient in them, there's something called the 10,000 hour rule, which I don't know if Malcolm Cladwell was the first one to come up with it, but you do need about to really become proficient in whatever your practice area areas and.

Okay at it. You need about five years of, 2000 hour years. And that's why I don't think anyone really should ever leave a firm or leave the law firm market for at least five years. Cause it's really where you learn. Then six years of experience, these last ones will go fairly quickly and we'll be ready to take breaking questions, but senior attorneys with more than six years of experience, no business really shouldn't be using a recruiter and unless they're they typically, when you get to this level, not again, [01:06:00] this is not a hard and fast rule in smaller markets.

It's probably six years and larger markets. It's more. But that, again the stuff I said earlier about billing rates and all that applies and if you're not partner material, a lot of times at this point, people will, or you don't want to be a partner, which is perfectly acceptable will seek jobs many times in other practice settings or in house.

And but when senior attorneys look for a job, again, there's a presumption and not always the case, but there's a presumption that, that attorney was not. And unless you've been at the same firm for six or seven years, but there's a presumption that you may not be adding enough value through your hours, the quality of work, your commitment your potential.

To stay at your firm because they, expected to have a home at that point. At least for the ride to partnership. You don't have to, but but if you if you have that much experience and you're looking, especially if you've had several jobs before this last job, and you have more than six years of experience, the presumption that you might be a liability, there might be problems with you.

They don't know. Also if you [01:07:00] were trained in another firm then or different firms a lot of times senior trainers are set in their way. When you tell them what to do, they're who are you to tell me? I've been doing this for seven years or 10 years.

They're not as good at taking orders or not as enthusiastic. That's not always the case, but this is the, these are the reasons that firms give for not being as interested in them. So these are just things to think about. And then also as they get more experienced they lose a lot of times your sense of optimism.

So this optimism, it can be channeled into hours. People wanna work with people that are enthusiastic. They wanna work with people that aren't cynical. They wanna work with people. Are that want that and and have that drive and insight and are bringing new ideas and really believe.

And if as people get more senior, they see the ride they see, okay, this doesn't, I'm not gonna get ahead. I don't, they've had too many bad experiences, so it can't it doesn't always work. It's almost I don't know an example of a dog, so I in-law was visiting me not too long ago and brought a dog.

And the dog was from an had found an Indian [01:08:00] reservation and was like, he walked towards the dog. It was the most affectionate dog ever, but you'd walk towards the dog and it would cower, like it was afraid he was gonna get hit. That's had a bad experience. So attorneys are like that too.

Like they will become sometimes hardened or it is just as they get more seniors. So you, that, that's one of the things that law firms are getting. So if you don't have an one six years of experience, you don't have any business, your options are you can either generate, you can generate business quickly.

This is what a lot of people will try to do. They'll put together business plans. And that sort of thing. And and they, the, typically these business plans aren't really worth much because the person could get business. They would have it by now, but that they will like, they, they like that.

And sometimes the business plans will pan out a new firm. And then and then if you do have business they'll typically ask you to see that you've had business and some sort of proof of what that business is and and okay. Or the other thing that they like is they want if you're in a specialized, highly vary demand practice here.

I, law firms, when the market gets very hot for different [01:09:00] practice areas, we'll hire senior attorneys all the time. So when interest rates are very low, they love hiring senior real estate attorneys. When the stock market is doing well, they hire lots of senior securities attorneys.

When there's a lot of merger activity, they hire lots of senior, you M and a attorneys when. The patent market. It hasn't been like that in a long time, but when that was very hot, they were hiring lots of senior patent training and healthcare was hot, same thing. So all this stuff, different practices.

It's not to say that if you're senior and don't have any business, you're outta luck, you could be in luck if you're in the right practice area and even recently litigation for the first time senior market marketable too. So it just, but it just depends. So the but you have to remember that law firms hire specialists, non generalists.

And so if you get more senior and you been doing nothing, but the same thing for a long period of time chances are, even if you don't have business there's going to be some market in the country that is going be interested in you. There's, it's very funny, like you have these markets where different things are going on and you, gas prices are up.

All of a [01:10:00] sudden Texas is booming or or they're North Dakota or it's just, it's fun. This is just how it works. And so there's always gonna be PR areas in the country where certain things are marketable and during COVID all of a sudden these, all these trust in the estate's attorneys were incredibly marketable, which is funny and family law, because I think everyone was at home was getting divorced.

I don't know, but it's just, all this stuff happens. And and. The other thing that's interesting is there's I, there's lots of securities attorneys in New York, but there's not a lot of them in upstate in New York and or Detroit in other places, you always get calls from firms looking for other securities attorneys in those markets.

Those are just a few I'm thinking of, but and just because you're senior don't have business doesn't mean you're not marketable. It just means you may not be marketable in certain markets. And and and if you have more than six years of experience in any business, you just need to demonstrate that you may have extensive experience and in a certain practice share and you're willing to really willing to put your foot down or head down and work hard.

And and if you're in demand practice here, I place, by the way, Senior attorneys all the time that are in [01:11:00] demand, practice chairs. Typically, if you look at the resumes, it's doing nothing, but that practice area or having a lot of experience. And then this is another one. I hate to bring this up.

This is the last one. This will go pretty quickly, but there's certain states like California which has a pretty hard bar exam for lateral attorneys. There's Florida. And you would have to review all of the different state requirements, but if you're not admitted to the bar you're definitely anywhere you're not marketable yet.

But but some states are very easy. Lots of people try to get jobs in Washington, DC, cuz it's very easy to wave into, California and Florida, you definitely have to take the bar exam. If you're not admitted to the bar there so you have to do that. You have to and the reason just a lot of people become interested in move into California and then they take the bar and and the attorney's bar exam is very difficult.

I There's a lot of very well known attorneys that have failed the attorney's bar exam, which is the exam for people that are already admitted. But even the real bar exam is very hard. I You people that study for it, I you need about a month of. [01:12:00] Uninterrupted study maybe five or six weeks, but you can pass it.

Any attorney can pass it, but you need to take the time. And people don't always do that. And and then there's other states that you can into, but if you can't, if you need to take a bar exam again, just think about it from the point of view, it's very difficult for them to hire you laterally because they don't know what's going, they don't know if you're gonna pass or and it's a big risk, especially if you moving out and if you don't pass, then then you do that.

So what a lot of people will do I work with people all the time that wanna move to one of these states, where you can take the bar and they'll just they'll study for the bar. I don't know how they do it, but they'll study while they're employed and then we'll take the bar exam and And then pass it.

And then after they pass it, they will they'll often have been interviewing in anticipation of the bar exam results and then they'll give them, and then their offers will the firms will hire them. Firms will often wait, they'll make an offer contingent on passing the bar. And then once the bar exam comes in, [01:13:00] you can get it.

Or sometimes they'll even wait to pass the bar, cuz your op your options are obviously a little bit better. It's a little easier once you have the bar in those states. And then if you aren't admitted and you're trying to apply to a certain state and you can wave in, then you should try to do that and say, I'm already doing it.

I'm close and stuff. So a lot of the law firms though in markets where it's difficult to pass the bar, which are places California and New York and so forth will want you to pass the bar first. So these are just some other tips and I don't know how relevant these are, but these are just, these are some things that I recommend most people that don't meet these qualifications and you may be watching this and think, what do I do?

Like I'm, I don't have enough experience or I there's too much going on in terms of my practice areas, which I think anybody clean up the resume there's there's you know, what do I do to get a position We don't work with you, can I get one on my own? And and these are some ways you can do it.

These are some secrets I'm sharing with you that I think are exciting. One of the first is you can apply to a lot of firms in your market without openings. This is one of the most [01:14:00] effective ways to get a job. There is because law firms, if you apply to firms that don't have openings, especially firms that aren't on the radar of a lot of people.

So all over the country most firms the, aren't gonna be listed in directories may not be the places you've heard of, but there could be incredible groups of people there. I've been, I've looked at firms in the middle of the Midwest and there's like Supreme court clerks are just law firms of six people and like what the heck's going on.

So there's great firms everywhere, and they're not always in directories and you can find them all sorts of different ways. I Google's one of them but there's a lot of places. So you should apply to as many firms as you can. If you feel like there's problems with your background, this is how we find firms for people.

And we use all sorts of directories and and and and the reason is because when someone shows up with an application, it's much easier for that firm to hire them than it is to search for a new attorney. So they would much rather. Hire someone, even if there's not some, even if you're one of those 10 things and your background is off or even five of those 10 [01:15:00] they'll sometimes overlook that if you're the only applicant.

So that's one of the secrets is to be the only applicant. And I don't know, again, I don't know how many times to emphasize that. But if you're in a big city and there's an opening firm there's gonna be a lot of applicants you're competing with. So you may think you're special and you probably are.

Everyone is, but but if you're the only applicant for firms again, same thing applied to firms that are on the radar that don't receive a lot of applicants. Everyone is always trying to get jobs in the same places. The other, this is a big thing that I recommend you always need to apply to firms just as soon as they have openings.

So what that means is if a firm has an opening, typically what'll happen is the first day or two, when that opening's new, if it's on a job site or where maybe you sign up for the large from the firm, I don't know, but or recruiters get it. The market will be saturated with PE trying to get people to apply and then people will apply and then the firm will get all these outlets.

Right away. It's a lot of work. Just to review a hundred applicants [01:16:00] takes hours. I So they're gonna review the first applicants to come in and they may spend a few hours diligent reviewing those first applicants, but then they're gonna select a few people out of that group to interview.

And they're not gonna want to go spend hours reviewing the applicants that come in after 'em and I'm sorry, but they don't. So you need to be the first person to apply. I, this is a huge piece of advice. I send jobs to BCG candidates all the time and they just sit on 'em and they don't always apply right away.

Some people do, but the majority of people, know, you're practicing law, you're busy and that's understandable. But if you are among the first applicants, you always stand them much better chance of getting in and getting hired because the other thing the do too. Is then they'll interview one or two people or three or four, and they'll bond with someone.

And then it's game over. Like they're gonna hire that person. They connect with them, that person bonds, that person seems enthusiastic. And then even if you're 10 times better applicant, you come later, then you're never gonna get seen. The other thing to understand is the largest markets, which are Los Angeles, Chicago and York, Houston [01:17:00] are one of the reasons, big companies and big law firms move there is because it's very easy for them to find people.

So if you are in one of those markets and there's something that perfect about your application, meaning one of those 10 things or two are wrong, you're obviously going to increase your chances of getting a position. If you're able to apply to smaller markets or markets that aren't as popular that people aren't necessarily flocking to and trying to get jobs in.

That's a smart move, right? Why not? This is what I do all the time. I had one woman I was working with not too long ago and she'd had a horrible experience. I don't know, like I think it really bad. I think her into it, but I think her husband died at a very young age and I don't know how he did, but it was something.

Just catastrophic and very emotionally devastating and she had some sort of breakdown that led to, I don't know, but anyway, so she had been unemployed. This is in her first year of practice. She unemployed for [01:18:00] a year. And but she had some experience. I think she was in San Francisco and and no one would hire her there.

Cuz they had plenty of applicants, at least not. And she was able to get, way too many. So many interviews, she wasn't going out on a but, and she wasn't even from, she wasn't from even, I don't, she was from a top 50 law school and she was coming from a meeting firm, but she was able to get an incredible number of interviews and we actually got mad at her cuz she wasn't going on them.

In smaller markets, meaning, maybe not Chicago, but Springfield or maybe not spring, but just smaller markets around the country and not the largest markets. And so that's smart. And so you're often better off applying to markets where there's not a lot of jobs because the more the larger the market, the more they can afford to be very aggressive because they're gonna receive a lot about these qualifications cuz they're receiving a lot of applicants and and that's again, why people wanna work in these major cities is.

A lot of it has to do a firm setup because of the talent pool. And then you can also apply to in other markets without jobs. So I always recommend [01:19:00] applying the firms and other jobs now, the prestige levels, the whole discussion, but at BCG, like we rank firms and then your experiences ranked in one to five.

So five means would be the top firms with the top qualifications required. And there's very few of them. But these five firms, and then you go four, which typically is your, just your typical am law, 100 firm. And then your threes, which your typically am law 200 maybe even less than that, which are, these are firms that work for businesses and typically large businesses.

And as you move down the raw the prestige levels, then you start getting into firms that do things like. We're representing consumers, which is not, again, there's nothing not prestigious about that, but we do these rankings to show, the size of the business the five firms are the largest businesses that the least cost sensitive.

And as you get down to one, you're talking about businesses and firm are clients that are very cost sensitive, meaning, if you send 'em a bill for a thousand dollars, as opposed to 500, they're gonna really be upset [01:20:00] about that. So maybe not that well, yeah, I would say that's probably accurate to some extent.

So the point is if you are used to applying the three and four firms and you apply to two firms, you're gonna have a lot more luck. And so you just have to of move down the prestige level of the firms and that's all. And and then you can always move up later. If so, if you're having a hard time getting a job at a firm that represents I dunno, public companies then maybe go to a firm that represents private companies.

If you're having job hard time there represent of, just smaller than that's all. And you'll always be able to get a position, anyone get a job by the way, it's just, you have to apply to the right places. And and then you have to apply. Many times employing in different practice settings.

So if you're having a hard time getting a job in a law firm you can always apply to firms, have a much better chance getting a position in the government or public interest or in house or other things. And and if you're trying to in the market, you're in, because that's they get people that don't wanna work in law firms most times that can be helpful.

So those are just some tips I wanted to give you [01:21:00] if you don't meet these criteria I do think that this stuff is amazingly important. And there is a article that hasn't come out. I dunno if it's on BCG but I'll try to provide that link and hopefully by next week, if you are in the webinar, but it'll be on the website soon.

This stuff is really important because if you wanna get hired it, this is how people are looking at you. And so a lot of times people don't really see how others are looking at them or what makes them competitive and not competitive. Otherwise they wouldn't be doing these things.

So I'll take a quick break. And then when I come back, I'll answer as many questions as everyone has about this or any other questions that you have by your careers. Thanks.