How Attorneys Can Get a Job During and After a Job During and After a Federal Clerkship

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2022-0601 - How Attorneys Can Get a Job During and After a Job During and After a Federal Clerckship
[00:00:00] So this today I'm going to be talking about how to get a position during and after federal clerkship, federal, but it could be any clerkship. So it's not necessarily that important. What type of clerkship but I've done this cause I clerked for a judge and a federal judge.
And and so certainly I have experienced doing this and I've also placed hundreds of people coming out of different types of clerkships. Do you know something about it? And and so I'm, hopefully I can be of a lot of help for Q today. So the first thing is that when you're working in a judge's chambers, it's really a lot different than working in a law firm.
A lot of attorneys their first job is with a federal job and they have spent a little bit of time working with in a law firm in the summer, but the expectations and the deadlines and so forth, and the types of people you work with. Are often much different in law firms than they are in in doing a clerkship.
And one of the first things to understand this a lot of law firms, especially when they're hiring laterally, you're not coming into, if you don't have a job lined up after your clerkship, that you've [00:01:00] maybe a place you worked in the summer and so forth. They're not generally lining up looking for clerks.
I do like clerks. I think clerking is a very good thing. And I'll talk about that today. But they're often a little bit suspicious of quirks because they they often don't have the work or the experience to, to work in very competitive environments. So they may work for a very good judge.
They may be very good attorneys, but they may not have the experience to actually work inside of a law firm. I was when I was a summer associate, I was a summer associate in a law firm. And one of the partners there and this was a long time ago, but she started her career crevasse and she said, if you are a crevasse and you said you were in a clerkship, they would be like, why are you doing that?
They wouldn't, because they wouldn't know you're going to get more, a better experience here. So a clerkship can be a very positive but for some firms it's not always as appreciated as you might think it would be. And I certainly thought it would be very appreciated and I had a great experience to it, by the way.
But at the same time you need to understand that there are some drawbacks to being a clerk. One of the things But, they're often not as [00:02:00] motivated to work in a law firm. And so that lack of motivation and being more on the side of wanting to clerk is something that's not always a positive.
W what happens is a lot of works do go to law firms, and then I don't end up staying there. Also. In terms of the type of clerkship you do you could end up working for a judge. That's not going to give you the best habits. There are some very good federal judges that come out of very strong legal backgrounds.
And there's a federal judges that don't and are state judges that don't and state judges that do. So the pedigree of the judge you work for and their experience and work habit is going to rub off on you. In terms of expectations. They have lots of judges by the way, don't have any experience working in law firms.
A lot of them have been done things where they've been prosecutors, so they might've been academics. They might've had a bunch of different government jobs and then Judges because of the lack of opportunity elsewhere. Usually not usually they're actually very good attorneys but they're not always the type of people that would be hired by a major law firm.
It's different being a judge has a is a, is an academic job to some extent, but it's [00:03:00] also can be somewhat bureaucratic and people are elected to judge ships and they're appointed to federal judgeships based on connections and with political parties and so forth. So there's, they're not always screening for the best attorneys.
And it's a different type of skills. A judge may not have the skills to do things that are needed in the law firm, which are to attract clients in business and to work very long hours meaning a hundred plus hour, weeks and so forth. They do other things that attorneys and and the largest law firms need to do it's not maintenance and again, it's not a criticism of the judges, but it's and judges are a very important part of, one of, if not the most important part of the legal system and a lot of respects, but but the training can sometimes be all over the map that that you get under a judge.
And the intellect of the judge just as there are very smart attorneys, there's very smart judges and. Ones that aren't at the federal level there's very good judges that are very smart usually, and same thing at the state level, especially in the larger cities. But you just don't know.
And the problem is when you work for a judge you're going to [00:04:00] be trained to some extent in their work habits and their way of thinking about the law. And and, in some laws firms will like that and others won't. And and it depends on the judgment at times, but I've seen a lot of attorneys that are hired.
Clerks would have been hired by federal by law firms. And th they don't last, their work is not considered high quality. They may have picked up bad habits and they don't end up working out in the law firm in the long run. But this is usually not the case. It's usually actually the opposite that clerks get very good experience.
And but the point isn't and the reason I'm saying this is I'm trying to make sure that I think a lot of people, when they come out of clerkships, they believe that they're holier than now. And to some extent I think there's a huge advantage of the clerkship because you're working directly with a judge for a one to two years.
You're getting a lot of input on your work, your. Learning a lot of things that you may not necessarily learn practicing in a law firm and you're getting direct input on your on your work product, which is extremely important. And but for the most part there's more [00:05:00] need for that or else with experience in law firms when there was clerks, because clerks, they don't always know if they're going to work out.
And and and it's definitely more difficult to get a job in a major law firm out of law school as litigator than as a federal law clerk. The largest law firms are a little bit more competitive. Alisa Dunn, a federal district judge, chef maybe a palette is a little different, but it's also very competitive litigation and more practice to, to get a position in a law firm.
And and the thing about litigation is that virtually anyone can be a litigator. Because you learn the skills and law school, but a different practice areas like a Rissa AdMob and so forth to require different skills. These attorneys are almost always in higher demand. And and the idea is that anyone that graduates from law school can write and just being a clerk and writing is a good thing, but it doesn't make you always that special.
And again, I'm not saying I don't have any negative opinions about Clark's for me, it was a, one of the best things I ever did for my career, but at the same time I just, you need to understand that if you're clerking most of the time you're going to be going into [00:06:00] a general commercial litigation.
You're not necessarily, especially at the district court level, you're not getting exposed to a lot of white collar type work. And and in, in your typically if you want to go into IP litigation stuff, they typically prefer people from have done that directly. And generally general commercial litigator.
If I, when I work with clerks, I always classify them for the most part in our database. If they're right out of school and into a clerkship or with one year of experience, typically they're always going to be general commercial litigators and. And you're, that's pretty much what you need to be applying for with firms.
So that's something to think about. And then and then federal judges again do a lot of everything. They in terms of criminal work, they the sentencing and all that the clerks are really involved in that. Most of what a clerk does is they're working on opinions.
And and if you do want to do something like white collar litigation, which a lot of people do when they do clerkships you're often much better clerkships helpful, but you're often much better I'll work in our prosecutor's office or something. And and what a clerk does. I [00:07:00] If you're a clerk when you already know this, but it's pretty much you're just writing opinions.
You're taking a look at. Briefings on both sides of an issue. You're talking to the judge about the way he thinks, or she thinks things should come out. And then you're typically writing opinion and that doesn't make you qualified to be a white collar litigator, for example.
And and when you work for felon judging, maybe doing some IP work, but again, that's not going to make you qualify to be an IP litigator. And most IP litigators are, have science, very strong science backgrounds. And in these days, a lot of me the major scientific disciplines.
That's something to think about as well. And most far spot firms expect IP litigators to be admitted to the patent bar. And and and I worked at a firm when I started my career. I worked as a federal clerk and then worked at a law firm that likes clerks. And I think that when I was hired by them, I think most of the people.
That they were hiring were clerks. But so it can be a very good thing. And and again, I think it was one of the smartest things I ever did because of what it did is that it gives you an extra year or two years. If you take it to your clerkship, to to [00:08:00] improve your writing skills, to get input, to have things discussed with you and to become a better attorney.
But the point to understand is that, and then, cause this is about how to get a job after a bookshop that it doesn't mean you're not going to have to look hard for a job. Because I know of lots of clerks and I encounter them all the time that actually had to ask for extra years or time, because they couldn't find a job.
After clerking and the longer you clerk, the harder it does get to find a job because the law firms assume that you may not want to be a full-time attorney. And I know others who worked for without my help in major markets like Boston, New York. For looking for a year or more to find a job after courtship.
So just because you have had a clerkship doesn't mean it's not going to be easy that it's going to be easy to find a job. And because you're still going to be evaluated based on the things that, the schools you went to the how you did your summer associate work and so forth.
And so law firms are still gonna look at that. And a lot of people do get clerkships as flukes. [00:09:00] I had a candidate once that was very funny. She graduated with a C average from university of I don't, it doesn't matter, but I think it was university of Minnesota. Somehow she got an appellate clerkship right after graduating and went into that and then got another job at a huge firm.
I don't remember what the firm was, but it was. Really awesome from that never checked her grades. And then after that got another job at a really awesome farm after she didn't do well there. So people get clerkships all the time and then and they can actually get really good jobs from them too, but they do get clerkships a lot of times where they're not necessarily qualified for the they're not, you wouldn't, you would think they would be much better students and so forth.
And and then get good jobs. And a lot of people that shouldn't get those clerkships, don't and she had some other things on her resume that made her look really special. I don't remember what it was. She was on some law review or something, but the point is that lots of people get clerkships that may not be as qualified as those getting jobs in major firms.
And and so you need to understand a little bit about
Written that I think [00:10:00] is useful to review, especially for clerks is called the worst piece of job search advice ever, and something that I've noticed. And and it's really I've been going on for quite a while. That's when people look for jobs are under the impression that they should only apply to a few jobs or a job openings or the best firms and that sort of thing.
Under the apply to 10 firms or 20 firms and the top law firms, and think that they don't get hired by those, then they need to stay on and clerk. And you really need to look at a lot of different firms. And when I was a clerk, just to give you some perspective I applied to at least a couple hundred firms in the markets I wanted to work in.
And it worked and all the firms, I got jobs where it was didn't necessarily have openings. They you're applying when you're doing things like that, you're applying to law firms, not necessarily positions. And that's one of the most important things to think about when you're clerking is that you are applying to firms, not position in that necessarily jobs.
If a firm firms are businesses and and because they're businesses, if they have a need for someone, they will hire them. And so if you were a law firm [00:11:00] and you had 10,000 hours worth of litigation that you could bill out for per month, and you only had. I don't know, I'm 50 attorneys doing the billing.
I, man, I don't know. I'm just giving you an example. I don't know how to, where to map this, but, and you can plug more people in to do work you would, and because you're going to make money, if there's more people, so you can sit around and apply to firms and and that can work and it's a useful strategy, but just remember that most law firms are not applying or not posting jobs for what clerks as a law clerk, you really need to be applying to as many firms as possible.
So this is a very short webinar today. I'm gonna just take a quick break just for a few seconds to get another screen up here. And and then I will take as many questions as you have about this webinar or any other questions related to your job search and so forth.
So this is a live webinar, so I'm any questions you have, I will answer right now. So just a minute while I change the screen, then we'll get started.
Yeah.
Can we got a lot of good questions. Okay, so this is I'll answer the first and give me one second [00:12:00] here. Let's see. Not the first later one. So this is interesting. I have several classmates who did a clerkship right out of law school and who worked for a year. Affirm. And then Claire, what is the point of doing something like that?
I always thought firms like not the consu Clark. Yeah. So firms do like applicants who clerk. They do. Of course they do. The, and the benefits of clerking are really things that I think I mentioned in the webinar, which are once you clerk you're really getting you're getting good experience where someone's very closely reviewing your work.
Especially if you're working for a good judge that judges giving you lots of feedback, you're picking up their ways of thinking. You're working with very closely with other attorneys where there's not really, would it be your co clerk where there's no. Any particular pressure for one or one of you to get ahead or to best the other, for example.
So that's very helpful. And and so it's more of a cooperative atmosphere. You many times when I was clerking, you'd go out for lunch and you talk about cases and things. And and and th it's actually very interesting. You get to sit in court and you get to look at different sides of the [00:13:00] briefing and see, and get a sense of how different firms approach matters.
And and it's very useful. And when I was clerking and one of the things that was so interesting is when you look at. The papers from both sides. And you're trying to make a decision about a matter with the judge. You you really can see the side one side, a lot of stuff is just one of the papers and you can see who did a better job and so forth.
So it's very useful and very helpful. The point of law firms do people that clerk that the drawbacks sometimes of clerking are. That a lot of times law firms depending on the law firm may make it the sense that's not something you want to do. So are you don't may not want to practice in a law firm law in the longterm.
So a lot of people will clerk because they want to eventually do academic related stuff. And in law firms really depend on then that kind of wanting to be your first choice in terms of what you do. So if it looks like working at a law firm is not your first choice and what you're most not most interested in.
And if they sense that maybe you're a little bit more academic than the kind of person that would do well in a law firm, they may hire you, but most law firms. Especially a litigation law [00:14:00] firms like clerks and a lot of firms almost require you to be a clerk and under tough at some point are they hire primarily from clerks?
So it's a very useful thing. It's just, it can be it's something sometimes that is not useful in in, but it depends on you. I do think that some of the uses of it are that there are so many federal judges in the United States that many times you have a good chance. If you apply to a bunch of them in a bunch of different geographic areas to get a clerkship.
And if you don't think you're going to get a job with a top firm, many times, you have a better chance sometimes coming out of a clerkship, then you might not necessarily have just coming out of law school. Cause then you're just coming out of law school. Law firms are evaluating you based on your grades and where you went to law school and so forth.
And if you're coming from. Workshop the clerkship is means you have extra experience. And and that does look good for them to have that as something that they show their clients that you may have done. So that can be very helpful. Okay. Let's see here. Okay, this next question. This is a good question.
Is it clerkship possible with a federal [00:15:00] judge, for someone with a medical grade from a top law school? Yes, absolutely. So a lot of times a federal judge, a federal judges will typically hire people. Based the ones that they people that they like and feel can do the job. And it's especially, so there's, and keep in mind there's federal judges all over the country.
There's federal judges in North Dakota and South Dakota in every small and large state in in places that would be desirable to work on places that aren't desirable to work. They're all over. So there's pretty much in every major metropolitan market, there's federal judges, but there are also federal judges and a lot of smaller markets in places where you would never think you'd want to live.
So that's one of the benefits of a clerkship is that there's so many federal judges out there that if you apply to places where people aren't trying to work, which are. Miami Hawaii you places like that, you have a much better chance of getting a job. So I've seen lots of people, especially on a top law schools get clerkships in places you would not think of you wanting to work, which is like [00:16:00] Alaska and all sorts of smaller markets.
And when I clerked, I thought I was going to be clerking in Detroit, but I ended up clerking then.
Area outside Detroit, which wasn't the nicest area. So it depends on where you apply. But I think that lots of people can get federal clerkships if they are. W if they're willing to work outside a major market. So the most in demand places are places like Chicago.
New York major city. That's where everybody wants to clerk. District clerkships are easier to get than appellate clerkships. So appellate clerkships typically are much harder. And the way when you start thinking about clerkships, what happens is there are appellate judges that are feeders to the Supreme court.
There are district court judges that are feeders to appellate courts. The other thing about clerking is it is somewhat political. There are obviously lots of democratic judges and lots of Republican judges. So if you look like a Republican. And you're applying to a Republican judge.
You're much more likely to get an interview and a job than if you look like a Democrat and you're applying to a [00:17:00] Republican judge and vice versa. When I was applying to judges I had some stuff that made me look a little bit political on my resume even though I wasn't but it just was there.
And and that helped me get a position I believe. And I think that judges will interview people because they're appointed by presidents who appoint them to clerkships based on their political leanings. So obviously if you're a hardcore Republican and applying to very liberal judges, that's probably not a good idea and vice versa.
That can your politics can help you quite a bit. Another interesting thing is there, there may, again, in New York city, there's probably lots of Republican judges, but there's probably much fewer, more far fewer public exchanges in New York city and are democratic judges. So if you're a Democrat and coming from a Southern town or a Southern law school, you might have our public enemy coming from a Southern law school.
You might have a pretty good chance of what the Republican judge in New York, as opposed to someone, because of what happens is the what's important. [00:18:00] What's important to understand about clerkships. And what's interesting is that that you have Democrats and Republicans and Democrats tend to think about social and political issues a certain way.
And Republicans think about. Corporations and social and political issues another way. And so most of the time, not all the time that they certainly use the law to come up with decisions, but the court the judges will rule in a way that is more The base is basically an allegiance, their political parties.
It's rare for them to rule any differently. So if the judge is very liberal, they're going to be much more likely to side in the behalf of plaintiffs and so forth. And they would on corporations, have a judges, very very conservative. They're much more likely to sign on behalf of companies and so forth.
And that's just how it is. There's nothing necessarily wrong with that. That's how the political system works. But depending on your background if you have a certain type of background regardless of what your law school is law firms judges will love you. So a very liberal judge is going to love seeing all sorts of.
[00:19:00] Organizations that look very liberal and so forth on your resume and will be very interested in that because they'll know that you're more likely to see the world like they, they do, and a very conservative judge the same thing. That's not to say that conservative judges don't hire lots of liberal people and vice versa, but at the same time that's really what judges are looking for.
Judges are looking for. And again, I'm not an expert in what judges are looking for, but for the most part, I judges want to be around people just like you do that. Think the way they do and are likely to support them. And if you come and do liberal judges Chambers and start coming up with these completely conservative use of things.
That's probably not going to be a good relationship. And so you have to be very, I think about that. So those are some things that I would recommend with the judgeships. I know that that it's just something that's very pretty obvious. But you don't really learn that until you become part of the system.
Okay. And I hope that helps, but the point is that anybody can get a clerkship. You can get, I've seen people get clerkships with federal [00:20:00] judges from a fourth year law school, if it didn't get well. So it doesn't necessarily matter. The most important thing is for the judge to like you and and for you to be the best applicant as well.
And being the best applicant often means you, if you put yourself into competition in a major legal market, which would be Miami, New York, Houston, and places like that Chicago, Los Angeles, San Francisco, you're going to have a much harder time getting a clerkship because. Seeing people from top five law schools and all sorts of people competing for the same clerkships.
But if you go into markets that aren't as popular, you have a better chance. And that's something to think about. Same thing as if you're a top student. If you're at a top law, if you're a top student at a, maybe not a top law school and you want to Clark in the appellate court, you're going to be better off.
You might have a nice chance getting a clerkship at a district court clerkship, but if you want to get a appellate court, kosher was gonna be a little bit harder. Okay. I'm hoping to work for a large law firm, possibly get a clerkship, but I'm worried that I've taken myself out of the running. I'm at [00:21:00] a top 10 law school and had deplore final semester.
And we'll probably be in the bottom half of my class also struck out during OCI with large law firms instead of summer to a small boutique firm outside of New York city. And I was invited gender for my graduation. I've been making about a third of all of my classmates at large law firms were making some of whom I outperformed my first year.
I'm hearing conflicting information about whether I have any shot at a large law firm and feel extremely angry, discouraged by my situation. I'm grateful to be employed with a good firm that I'm not where I expected to be. And I feel that there's no way for me to move on from here are my odds of getting to a large law firm, getting a clerkship realistic.
Should I maintain my goal, gain drew a large law firm and do what I possibly can to get there the possible. Yeah. So if you went to a a top 10 law school and you're working as a litigator coming out of a school, even though you did have. Second to last semester. And I don't think it matters.
I think that I think you can definitely get a position. You can definitely get a federal clerkship if you want. After I would get apply after your first year, [00:22:00] you could probably get one maybe even in the summer of judges that have openings. But I don't think You really have anything to worry about it?
I think you'll have a pretty easy time during their courtship. And I think that also after your clerkship, I think that you will be able to get a job with a large law firm. And I also would say after even a year, working for the small firm you'll probably be able to move. Even if you didn't do a clerkship to a large law firm after you get the experience.
I A lot of times what you're learning is you're learning ways of thinking and interacting with people and all sorts of things that you may not have been an expert at when you were in law school. And there's nothing wrong with that and learning how to interview and and there's nothing wrong with some people are a little slower to pick up on the stuff than others.
And and just because you're a little slower to pick up on it doesn't mean you're gonna ha you're not going to be able to get a position. So I don't really think you have too much to worry about at all. I think you just need to learn whatever there is to learn about interviewing and then pick up there and get interested in the work you're doing.
When you do start doing the work in your law firm, work as hard as you can to put yourself into the work, be indispensable and be the best [00:23:00] attorney you can and continue learning and and learn for the sake of learning. Not for the sake of moving. So get enthusiastic about the work. And if you get enthusiastic about the work, then when you start interviewing after your first or second year, you'll be able to do much better.
The other thing I would say is that that I think a lot of people feel badly about themselves that go to the law schools or even good colleges, and they see people around them being more successful right off the bat, out of the gate. And that's a shame because there's really no reason for you to feel competitive with other people, the, your legal career, if you graduate from law school.
I don't know how old I was when I graduated, but early twenties. You're going to be practicing for a long time. I know attorneys that are in their eighties and still actively practicing and bringing in clients. So if you're graduating at the age of, I don't know, 24 you'll be conceivably practicing for another 60 years.
And so you can't really say that your entire legal career is over because of what happens in [00:24:00] one, one year out of of those, 60 plus years. It's ridiculous. That's one thing I would think about I think you've definitely get a clerkship. I think you can definitely get a job.
The other thing about grades, there's an article called law school grades in your career that I've written that it should be very helpful to review, but grades really don't matter. I don't think People really care too much about your grades after you've been practicing for at least for a year, then your experience becomes more relevant.
Grades are just something that law firms use to compare you to other people that are coming also graduated from law school at the same time you are, but they're not really relevant after a while. So I don't think you have anything to worry about if you were able to get into a top 10 law school.
You're obviously very smart and have a a good background. And so there's nothing really to worry about my piece of this biggest piece of advice to you would be whatever caused you to get bad grades. You wanna do what you did when you were getting good grades when you're studying for the bar.
Cause you definitely want to pass the bar and work as hard as you can on that. So I think a lot of people, [00:25:00] especially this time of year and a lot of people are going to top law schools assume that just because they went to a top law school the bar exam and so forth can be easy and that's just not true.
You're competing with a lot of people seeing you to do work as hard as you possibly can. Good. See here Is cooking enough to make up for work networking in a large firm during summer. Just put this here summer post-graduation, I've come from a top law school and beginning to small firms.
Yeah. Clerking is definitely enough to make up for that. Keep in mind that in each year, there's, I don't know what the numbers is, but there's 30,000 plus people that graduated from law school. There's probably only a, I don't know, 500 to a thousand clerkship openings. So it's a very prestigious thing that would be at the federal district level.
And then you have the pellet, so it is a good thing. And it can definitely make up for not working the top law firm. So law firms. Definitely are interested in people that have the training. They need people that can, they need people that are dedicated and have learned. And Chuck clerking also shows a form of commitment.
And and so that commitment means that [00:26:00] you're committed to practicing law, even above making money. So I think it's a great thing. A lot of schools sometimes people will get a graduate from really top law schools. And and when they graduate from these really good law schools, what happens is they often don't have jobs.
And so what they do is they try to get clerkships, even state core clerkships coming out, and then and that can help you quite a bit. Good. Let me see any other questions. Okay. And then I think there's a question about clerkship. I think that's about it. So this was a very quick webinar and it doesn't have any more questions I'm just putting th there's another question in terms of looks like what a judges look for in clerks.
Again, it depends on the judge, so some judges will but I think one of the things that they look for is they want to make sure that you will, you're enthusiastic and you respect them and what they do. So I think the respect of the judge is important and then they want to believe that you'll that you'll be able to be managed and see things from their point of view.
So I think that's about that. Let's see the standard questions. So I think that's [00:27:00] about it. So I appreciate everyone being on this webinar today. I know this was a quick webinar. And we didn't cover there wasn't very much today, but it was a helpful just for people to learn about clerkships.
One thing I would say about as, I, I do think if you're, if you want to be a litigator, I do think they are a good idea. I think that you can you definitely get exposed to a lot of things that you might not otherwise get exposed to. And and it's really an opportunity where you have someone you can go under someone's wing in a non-competitive environment, and they can coach you for a year and you can learn and watch them and learn lessons, and then watch how other attorneys work in the courts that can be very useful.
And Oh thank you for all the questions. I appreciate it. And and then next week on, let me see here. There's another question. Let me just see here. Okay. Yeah. And any other questions you guys have? I'm happy to answer them. Let me just see here. Let's see here. Gross. Sorry.
Clerking. A good idea for someone two to three hours out of law school, transition to another area of the law. Yeah, if you're a most clerks, most judges will hire people to be [00:28:00] clerks. Only if they're coming, if they want to be litigators. Litigation's is really the main reason. Most judges will not hire someone.
That's a corporate attorney to be a clerk they want, they really want you to be interested in litigation and show some interest in litigation. If you're trying to transition to another area of the law for example, it's very rare for corporate attorneys to be clerks. It's very rare for patent attorneys to be clerks.
You, you have to ask to be you have to be what you're doing has to be related to litigation. Now sometimes labor and employment attorneys will be clerks and that sort of thing. But but if you only, if you want to do a litigation, but yeah, it's very common for people with two to three years of experience to, to be clerks.
I think there's lots of attorneys that have experience about that, that do that. See here. How do you handle one second here?
What would, how would you handle interview questions about reasons for leaving more than one or two firms? So when law firms hire you, that's a good question. When law firms hire they're actually, [00:29:00] and this is anybody that's hiring, they're asking, can you do the job? Will you do the job?
Long-term job term. I've written a lot of articles about this, but I'm just writing this down. Can you be managed
You want the job
and then do we like you
and and they're also asking you like this, but these are the big questions we're asking. So the problem with anyone, like when you make you. More than one or two firms. Now I'm assuming you mean in a short period of time or you've not unemployed or something or you've been leaving leaving jobs.
One of the problems with that is that that a lot of times when there's periods of unemployment on someone's resume, The assumption is that person may have lost their job. There's all sorts of negative implications of that. And and so that that's one of the first things is that.
And so they'll think that maybe you can't do the job and doing a job may mean there may be performance issues with the work you do. It could also mean a bunch of different things, or maybe you just can't handle the stress of working for the employer. But but the employer, when they're interviewing, you wants really needs to make sure that they really, you need to make sure [00:30:00] that that you can do the job.
And so if there's a lot of periods of unemployment or you have left certain jobs, they may think that you can. So that's one of the first things now. But, and sometimes they're willing to overlook that, but the other thing they're going to ask themselves is will you do the job long-term so just think about it if you were if you were an employer and and I used an example.
I'll use a simple example of just, if you were hiring someone to watch your kids and to, I don't know long someone to watch your kids every day for 10 years, would you want to hire someone that you know is flipping about it and may not seem interested or had a lot of different jobs?
What happens that the idea of the asking about if someone can do the job long-term is most employers want to hire people that look like they're going to stick around and that the employers can invest in training them and introducing them to their clients and the person's going to work out. So if the person, if the law firm feels like you're going to leave.
And that's a big risk for them. And they're much more likely to hire people with employment, stability than [00:31:00] people that have left a lot of jobs. The other question is, can you be managed? What that means is that the law firms asking themselves as are you going to follow instructions? Are you going to do things are you willing to listen to input and all that sort of thing?
And and if you have a lot of period periods of unemployment in your resume there are certain people that if you ask them to do something, we'll always do it or they'll do what they can to get along and so forth. So these are the problems with that. And if you have questions about why you left different firms, typically the best way to answer them is things that show you, that you could do the job that you'd want to stick around and you can be managed.
And a lot of times, the reasons for that are. The best way to answer those questions in a way that shows that there's some sort of upward mobility to your resume that that you're trying to always been trying to improve yourself, or sometimes that forces under your outside of your control created a situation where you ended up having to move firms or lose lost your job.
But these are what they're concerned [00:32:00] about. And just keep in mind that. Th they're asking these questions because they really, they don't want to hire someone that they don't feel can do the work. They don't want to hire someone. They don't want to train you and introduce you to clients and have you leave.
They don't want to train. They don't want you, someone that's not going to follow instructions do think a certain way. And so these are the reasons are asking these questions. And you all your answers to questions about having worked in a bunch of different places really need to be framed in that way.
And you need to become an expert in answering that. And and I really most of the time I recommend stories about upward mobility things changing and and trying to phrase any move is is a reason you are trying to improve yourself. And just remember that any answer you give, if you give the employer reasons.
I think that you may not be interested and working for them in the longterm that or you may want to do something else or you may be not invested and they're not going to like them. Okay. Next one here, does it make sense to garner supply for DC circuit clerk, clerkships and have already accepted offers at the district and [00:33:00] appellate levels?
Both at the same time. Okay. So just your circuit clerkships and of Arctics of that offers of the district and appellate level this in time. No I don't think you should be applying if you've already accepted a clerkship. I don't think you should, if you, I don't think you should be applying for an overlapping clerkship.
If you've already accepted if you've already accepted one clerkship and then not. Oh, I'm saying you may be talking about a clerkship after doing a district and appellate clerkship and then applying for a certain core clerkship. It may. I think once you buy the thing is that I think once you get into your clerkship you especially for doing an appellate clerkship, you may, and if you want to potentially a clerk on the Supreme court then, or you want to clerk for a judge, you have a lot of respect for then that may make sense.
Most of the time though, if you're doing an appellate clerkship, the appellate judge that you're working for will start referring you and helping you get. Positions with other judges if that's what you want to do. The problem with doing too many clerkships and it is a problem if you do too many clerkships, then you start [00:34:00] looking more like an academic, and there's nothing wrong with being an academic or career clerk.
But law firms really after one or two clerkships, a law firm is going to start thinking that, This, person's really not interested in practicing law. They're more interested in clerking and you become you, you look like a different product. And again, there's nothing wrong with me in a different product, but the law firms are really more interested in people that that want to be career attorneys inside of law firms.
So three clerkships, once you start getting the three, three plus years clerking it does make you look like a little bit different of a product and the law firms do get nervous about that. Clerkship's good. But the problem is that after you've done several years of clerking you kinda have different habits and different ways of working that the law firm feels may not be untrainable.
And and that's things like paranoid about deadlines, learning how to bring in clients and other things that people learn to do in law firms. Okay. Let's see here. I think that's about it. So if anyone doesn't have any more questions, I appreciate all the questions about clerking mag.
This is I was surprised that we were doing this webinar today and it was [00:35:00] prescheduled and by the time it was scheduled was too late to change. And I didn't, I realized this doesn't apply to a lot of people. But I hope it's helpful and and for people in the future. So thank you for being on the webinar today and there's no more questions.
I'll talk to everyone next week. Thanks.